The Myth of Sisyphus
Moderators: Clemsy, Martin_Weyers, Cindy B.
The Myth of Sisyphus
Camus' final analysis in the Myth of Sisyphus is summed up as follows: "The struggle itself towards the heights is enough to fill a man's heart. One must imagine Sisyphus happy." Is this a Life Affirming or Life Denying mythology? Joseph Campbell talks a lot about the vast differences between these two forms of mythology. What do you think he would say about Camus' conclusion?
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Hi zpgurley and welcome to the JCF Forums!
Great question. I think one of Campbell's better known quotes may answer it:
Cheers,
Clemsy
Great question. I think one of Campbell's better known quotes may answer it:
The Myth of Sisyphus is a common metaphor for life's struggles, no? I think whether it is life affirming or denying depends on one's attitude. Maintaining a joyful attitude can be... challenging. I think, at the end of the day it can be life affirming, which is encouraging enough for me.Participate joyfully in the sorrows of the world.
Cheers,
Clemsy
Give me stories before I go mad! ~Andreas
Thank you Clemsy,
This question has been on my mind for some time now. Camus' conclusion has come to be mine as well, and I believe JC would agree with it as well, at least to some degree, as indicated from the quote you offered.
I have listen to most, if not all, of JC's CD colletions at least a dozen times each, have watched Mythos half a dozen times and watched every interview I have been able to find. I've never read any of his books (not for a lack of trying), for I find that as a professor, Campbell was a very polished lecturer, i.e. oral storyteller, and I find him most accessible through his spoken words.
A common theme in Campbell's talks is this idea of life affirming vs. life denying mythologies. How most, if not all, of the ancient mythologies are life affirming. They say yay to life in all of it's aspects, both monstrous and sublime. Modern age mythologies have much more of a life denying character. They say nay to all, or varying degrees and aspects of life. JC gives Buddhism as an example in one of his talks and often quotes Schopenhauer's famous words that "life is something that should not have been."
To make a long story short, I have traveled down the road that says that fear, desire, hate, pain, sin, etc. should not be. This is a life denying mythology, because there IS fear, hate, pain, sorrow. As JC would say, life feeds on life and it is horrendous. It is also beautiful and magical and wondrous. I have a child, I know how wonderful it can be. It is all these things, and we, I, can do nothing about it. We are all Indras (name that reference), and it is ABSURD to ask ultimate questions or seek meaning.
So where does that leave me. Enter Camus. This quandary was explored in great depth in Camus 'Myth of Sisyphus.' Camus uses a rather severe method to approach this topic. He asks 'if life is truly absurd, why not kill oneself?.' Camus doesn't screw around with his philosophical questions apparently. His final conclusion brings me back to my original post which states "The struggle itself towards the heights is enough to fill a man's heart. One must imagine Sisyphus happy." And this brings me back to my original question: is this a life affirming or life denying mythology/philosophy?
I believe, I feel in my gut that it is life affirming because it validates the rock, the top of the mountain and the bottom, the pain, the struggle and the inevitability of it all, and it says YAY to it.
By gosh Clemsy, I think you hit the nail on the head with that quote. Joyful participation. Sisyphus happy. That is awesome. That, indeed, seems to be the key.
Any other thoughts folks?
Patrick
This question has been on my mind for some time now. Camus' conclusion has come to be mine as well, and I believe JC would agree with it as well, at least to some degree, as indicated from the quote you offered.
I have listen to most, if not all, of JC's CD colletions at least a dozen times each, have watched Mythos half a dozen times and watched every interview I have been able to find. I've never read any of his books (not for a lack of trying), for I find that as a professor, Campbell was a very polished lecturer, i.e. oral storyteller, and I find him most accessible through his spoken words.
A common theme in Campbell's talks is this idea of life affirming vs. life denying mythologies. How most, if not all, of the ancient mythologies are life affirming. They say yay to life in all of it's aspects, both monstrous and sublime. Modern age mythologies have much more of a life denying character. They say nay to all, or varying degrees and aspects of life. JC gives Buddhism as an example in one of his talks and often quotes Schopenhauer's famous words that "life is something that should not have been."
To make a long story short, I have traveled down the road that says that fear, desire, hate, pain, sin, etc. should not be. This is a life denying mythology, because there IS fear, hate, pain, sorrow. As JC would say, life feeds on life and it is horrendous. It is also beautiful and magical and wondrous. I have a child, I know how wonderful it can be. It is all these things, and we, I, can do nothing about it. We are all Indras (name that reference), and it is ABSURD to ask ultimate questions or seek meaning.
So where does that leave me. Enter Camus. This quandary was explored in great depth in Camus 'Myth of Sisyphus.' Camus uses a rather severe method to approach this topic. He asks 'if life is truly absurd, why not kill oneself?.' Camus doesn't screw around with his philosophical questions apparently. His final conclusion brings me back to my original post which states "The struggle itself towards the heights is enough to fill a man's heart. One must imagine Sisyphus happy." And this brings me back to my original question: is this a life affirming or life denying mythology/philosophy?
I believe, I feel in my gut that it is life affirming because it validates the rock, the top of the mountain and the bottom, the pain, the struggle and the inevitability of it all, and it says YAY to it.
By gosh Clemsy, I think you hit the nail on the head with that quote. Joyful participation. Sisyphus happy. That is awesome. That, indeed, seems to be the key.
Any other thoughts folks?
Patrick
"The struggle itself towards the heights is enough to fill a man's heart. One must imagine Sisyphus happy."
Here is a happy Sisyphus, one that does not have to be imagined: http://www.keralafolklore.com/Naranath_Bhranthen.html
http://www.keralafolklore.com/Naranath_Bhranthen.html
"The most famous facet of Naranath Branthan's life is his apparently eccentric habit of rolling big stones up the hill and letting them roll down back, and laughing thunderously on seeing this sight. However this act has been often considered allegorical and has been applied for social critiquing for myriad contexts."
And I wonder if this might be part of the difference: "Unlike Sisyphus, he acted on his own volition rather than under the influence of a curse."
A conscious acceptance and attitude adjustment, just in how you look at life's struggle. You can struggle with life or you can be dead. It might have something to do with choice (free will?), to accept it and laugh or be cursed. Go with the flow or swim upstream.
Here is a happy Sisyphus, one that does not have to be imagined: http://www.keralafolklore.com/Naranath_Bhranthen.html
http://www.keralafolklore.com/Naranath_Bhranthen.html
"The most famous facet of Naranath Branthan's life is his apparently eccentric habit of rolling big stones up the hill and letting them roll down back, and laughing thunderously on seeing this sight. However this act has been often considered allegorical and has been applied for social critiquing for myriad contexts."
And I wonder if this might be part of the difference: "Unlike Sisyphus, he acted on his own volition rather than under the influence of a curse."
A conscious acceptance and attitude adjustment, just in how you look at life's struggle. You can struggle with life or you can be dead. It might have something to do with choice (free will?), to accept it and laugh or be cursed. Go with the flow or swim upstream.