Neo-Platonism: The beginning of Comparative Religion?
Moderators: Clemsy, Martin_Weyers, Cindy B.
I came across where James talks about Pragmatism; although the language is rather difficult.
But I get lost at
I understand the concept that thoughts lead to beliefs and that actions are based on beliefs that have been solidified in the mind (I’ve been saying something similar for a long time). I also understand why focusing on the “action” is important.An American philosopher of eminent originality, Mr.
Charles Sanders Peirce, has rendered thought a service
by disentangling from the particulars of its application
the principle by which these men were instinctively
guided, and by singling it out as fundamental
and giving to it a Greek name. He calls it the
principle of pragmatism, and he defends it somewhat
as follows:
Thought in movement has for its only conceivable
motive the attainment of belief, or thought at rest.
Only when our thought about a subject has found its
rest in belief can our action on the subject firmly and
safely begin.
Beliefs, in short, are rules for action; and
the whole function of thinking is but one step in the
production of active habits. If there were any part of
a thought that made no difference in the thought’s
practical consequences, then that part would be no
proper element of the thought’s significance.
To develop a thought’s meaning we need therefore only
determine what conduct it is fitted to produce; that
conduct is for us its sole significance; and the tangible
fact at the root of all our thought-distinctions is that
there is no one of them so fine as to consist in anything
but a possible difference of practice.
To attain perfect clearness in our thoughts of an object, we need
then only consider what sensations, immediate or
remote, we are conceivably to expect from it, and
what conduct we must prepare in case the object
should be true.
Our conception of these practical consequences
is for us the whole of our conception of the
object, so far as that conception has positive significance
at all.
This is the principle of Peirce, the principle of pragmatism.
Such a principle will help us on this occasion
to decide, among the various attributes set down in
the scholastic inventory of God’s perfections, whether some be not far less significant than others.
But I get lost at
Can anyone give an example?To attain perfect clearness in our thoughts of an object, we need
then only consider what sensations, immediate or
remote, we are conceivably to expect from it, and
what conduct we must prepare in case the object
should be true.
Infinite moment, grants freedom of winter death, allows life to dawn.
Nandu, thanks for the information.
Neo,
If I remember correctly Pragmatism taught that we must make decisions and act with imperfect knowledge and I think that paragraph is about reviewing possible outcomes. I could be wrong though.
Let's say I meet a lovely lady. What do I do? Immediately, she may give me great pleasure or make me feel worthless. In the long term we may raise a loving family or she may break my heart. What grief will I get from my relatives if I date her?
I weigh these outcomes and decide to say hello, but remind myself to reanalyze the situation in a few minutes.
Neo,
If I remember correctly Pragmatism taught that we must make decisions and act with imperfect knowledge and I think that paragraph is about reviewing possible outcomes. I could be wrong though.
Let's say I meet a lovely lady. What do I do? Immediately, she may give me great pleasure or make me feel worthless. In the long term we may raise a loving family or she may break my heart. What grief will I get from my relatives if I date her?
I weigh these outcomes and decide to say hello, but remind myself to reanalyze the situation in a few minutes.
Concretized thoughts, become beliefs (I like to use the word "schemas") which I agree are imperfect. Then separate schemas come together to form a whole "personal philosophy" of an individual. One false factoid embedded somewhere in this structure may yield a specific action.Roncooper wrote:Nandu, thanks for the information.
Neo,
If I remember correctly Pragmatism taught that we must make decisions and act with imperfect knowledge and I think that paragraph is about reviewing possible outcomes. I could be wrong though.
Let's say I meet a lovely lady. What do I do? Immediately, she may give me great pleasure or make me feel worthless. In the long term we may raise a loving family or she may break my heart. What grief will I get from my relatives if I date her?
I weigh these outcomes and decide to say hello, but remind myself to reanalyze the situation in a few minutes.
I would think a person wouldn't actively go looking for the source of the behavior until a negative action had occurred. And then, how could you tell if your "action" was from a false conscious belief or false subconscious reflection?
If my action resulted in "making a pass", how do I critically evaluate where the "flaw" was? It's just easier for me to move on and shrug it off as "Her loss."
Infinite moment, grants freedom of winter death, allows life to dawn.
I agree with you. My impression is that he would have a contingency plan in place for each alternative. He is trying to achieve a perfectly clear grasp on the situation and be as rational as possible.
Here is a humorous look at the situation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpH8qOEfrK8
Here is a humorous look at the situation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpH8qOEfrK8
Good example! Now if I could just put that back into words.Roncooper wrote:I agree with you. My impression is that he would have a contingency plan in place for each alternative. He is trying to achieve a perfectly clear grasp on the situation and be as rational as possible.
Here is a humorous look at the situation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpH8qOEfrK8
It's kind of like choosing a behavior, projecting it into the future, and making a decision tree for all possible outcomes.
That is until you exhaust all possible options and your "song" ends.
Infinite moment, grants freedom of winter death, allows life to dawn.
Neo,
On the Buddhism thread Rom brought up Hindu Dharma, which is different than Buddhist Dharma, and here you are discussing Taoism. I have been reading and it looks to me that they are very similar. Both are talking about living in accord with the natural way. Living in accord with the organizing rules of reality.
It seems to me that a person must first understand the rules that they can them choose to follow. This is the problem with Western religions. Blind faith in rules that came not from nature but from some cultural bureaucracy.
On the Buddhism thread Rom brought up Hindu Dharma, which is different than Buddhist Dharma, and here you are discussing Taoism. I have been reading and it looks to me that they are very similar. Both are talking about living in accord with the natural way. Living in accord with the organizing rules of reality.
It seems to me that a person must first understand the rules that they can them choose to follow. This is the problem with Western religions. Blind faith in rules that came not from nature but from some cultural bureaucracy.
I haven't thought about "blind faith" being a type of "artificial way" but I guess it is by default. It's interesting how the majority of the human race is always seeking some sort of way. Be that way religious, economics, political, or philosophical.Roncooper wrote:Neo,
On the Buddhism thread Rom brought up Hindu Dharma, which is different than Buddhist Dharma, and here you are discussing Taoism. I have been reading and it looks to me that they are very similar. Both are talking about living in accord with the natural way. Living in accord with the organizing rules of reality.
It seems to me that a person must first understand the rules that they can them choose to follow. This is the problem with Western religions. Blind faith in rules that came not from nature but from some cultural bureaucracy.
Now which "way" leads to the "truth" and which ways lead to the pit of doom?
Infinite moment, grants freedom of winter death, allows life to dawn.
Hello,
I know I haven't posted in a good while, but I just heard a song that came out in 1969 that stuck me and I thought I should share it. IMHO it sums up a good number of issues going on in the world today.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTBx-hHf4BE
I know I haven't posted in a good while, but I just heard a song that came out in 1969 that stuck me and I thought I should share it. IMHO it sums up a good number of issues going on in the world today.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTBx-hHf4BE
Infinite moment, grants freedom of winter death, allows life to dawn.
Neo,
I remember when that song was new. It was during the Vietnam War and I was in the army. Interestingly, because we were the good guys we didn't invade Vietnam for its wealth, we went in because the government believed in the "Domino Theory."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domino_theory
My friends and relatives fought and died for a perceived threat.
Back to the point you made. I agree with Campbell that the greatest treasure is enjoying life and being enthralled by the transcendent mystery, yet everyone spends their time chasing material "treasure." I have to confess I have an addiction for things I really don't need. People chase after happiness only to find the chase makes them unhappy. It's bazar.
Here's another song from that era. It is a little more tongue in cheek.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rArmFRkaFY
I remember when that song was new. It was during the Vietnam War and I was in the army. Interestingly, because we were the good guys we didn't invade Vietnam for its wealth, we went in because the government believed in the "Domino Theory."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domino_theory
My friends and relatives fought and died for a perceived threat.
Back to the point you made. I agree with Campbell that the greatest treasure is enjoying life and being enthralled by the transcendent mystery, yet everyone spends their time chasing material "treasure." I have to confess I have an addiction for things I really don't need. People chase after happiness only to find the chase makes them unhappy. It's bazar.
Here's another song from that era. It is a little more tongue in cheek.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rArmFRkaFY
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Hi Neo,
You are a sight for sore eyes, man. I enjoyed the video. "God With Us" says it all, doesn't it? Now that we are headed for a new round of wars, with volunteer cannon fodder, it's great to remember and reflect.
Welcome back to the Conversations. Sit a spell. Take your shoes off.
CarmelaBear
You are a sight for sore eyes, man. I enjoyed the video. "God With Us" says it all, doesn't it? Now that we are headed for a new round of wars, with volunteer cannon fodder, it's great to remember and reflect.
Welcome back to the Conversations. Sit a spell. Take your shoes off.
CarmelaBear
Once in a while a door opens, and let's in the future. --- Graham Greene
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Now, the Long War that happened in the 20th Century has given way to the never-ending War on Terror, which is not nation against nation, but simply a risk management venture that lines the pockets of corporations dedicated to war and mayhem. Society creates crime to have a dragon in the cave we can justify slaying, over and over again.Roncooper wrote:Neo,
I remember when that song was new. It was during the Vietnam War and I was in the army. Interestingly, because we were the good guys we didn't invade Vietnam for its wealth, we went in because the government believed in the "Domino Theory."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domino_theory
My friends and relatives fought and died for a perceived threat.
Back to the point you made. I agree with Campbell that the greatest treasure is enjoying life and being enthralled by the transcendent mystery, yet everyone spends their time chasing material "treasure." I have to confess I have an addiction for things I really don't need. People chase after happiness only to find the chase makes them unhappy. It's bazar.
Here's another song from that era. It is a little more tongue in cheek.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rArmFRkaFY
~
Once in a while a door opens, and let's in the future. --- Graham Greene
Hello Everyone,
I'm still on the "Journey." Some of you may be interested that I finally found the other Neo-Platonists. They were literally right under my nose, but I didn't know what they called themselves. It just so happens they call themselves "Quakers."
I wanted to share a video my children and I posted to Youtube on Wednesday. It's a little pre-holiday humor. See if you can spot all the allusions to mythology and Carl Jung.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qilyE7hzqE
Let me know what you think.
I'm still on the "Journey." Some of you may be interested that I finally found the other Neo-Platonists. They were literally right under my nose, but I didn't know what they called themselves. It just so happens they call themselves "Quakers."
I wanted to share a video my children and I posted to Youtube on Wednesday. It's a little pre-holiday humor. See if you can spot all the allusions to mythology and Carl Jung.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qilyE7hzqE
Let me know what you think.
Infinite moment, grants freedom of winter death, allows life to dawn.