Are Rites of Passage Really Necessary?

Share thoughts and ideas regarding what can be done to meet contemporary humanity's need for rites of initiation and passage.

Moderators: Clemsy, Martin_Weyers, Cindy B.

Lizpete
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Post by Lizpete »

To the Cove: What's the rite and the thought(s) for you? And when are we in that type of moment?

Clemsy, Clemsy, Clemsy where are you? (I need more than a "here" this time...)

What do you think Noman? I'm afraid the rite has been reduced to an echo of itself, just a nodding ritual. The individual then perhaps is creating then his or her own rites of passage, and maybe false ones at that.
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noman
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Post by noman »

It’s difficult to talk about rites of passage in the abstract. It can include so many different kinds of transitions in a person’s life – from child baptism, to manhood rites, to marriage, to some sort of social position and eventually to – the final passage. Birth rites and death rites don’t have an effect on the psychology of the initiate. But the ones in between do have or should have an effect on the initiate.

When I think of rites of passages I think in terms of songs. There’s always a tune that goes with the transition to a new stage. So a complete life sounds something like this.

1.) Rock a bye baby on the tree top… (birth)
2.) Twinkle twinkle little star… (a b c’s) (entering preschool)
3.) The graduation song (completing school)
4.) A military march song (entering the battlefield)
5.) The Wedding song (the marriage)
6.) The funeral march…(the funeral)
7.) Taps (the burial)
8.) Heaven, I’m in Heaven…(the after-life)

And all through life there is the annual song of Happy Birthday.

I don’t know who wrote the graduation song or the funeral march…you know… bammmm bammmm ba bammmm… baummm ba-baummm ba-baummm ba-baummm… But I think Wagner wrote that Wedding piece that we always use. Shows you how much I know about classical music. Anyway, the passages of life are marked by familiar melodies.

Societies have ‘melodies of passage’ as well. But it’s a different type of passage. It’s a cyclical passage. Consider the Auld Lang Syne of New Year’s celebration. Or the twenty or so familiar Christmas songs that we sing. Or a National anthem being performed prior to a big event. Or the Olympic Games anthem. It just seems that it isn’t a ritual unless there’s a melody to go with it.

- NoMan

Lizpete
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Post by Lizpete »

From the Cove:
Rites are made and done whether or not they have been done before. It is a natural response to change. Be it biological, mental, physical, environmental change that happens to the individual
And NoMan tells me there is music in the background to help with the transition, but that appears to echo the transitions of before. Part of the old confirmation rite and yet maybe also more fluid since perhaps the music does not seem to be fixed at a finite time or age for everyone. (But there do seem to be some transitional shifts in the music. What we listen to.) Older songs in particular seem to lose their popularity and influence a bit.

QUESTION: (Cove and NoMan) What is a new or recent rite of passage? (are there any?) And maybe, just maybe Noman you could find some in recent music?
All human wisdom is contained in these words: wait and hope. Alexandre Dumas <br>America: The call that every generation must improve itself. *Member Generation &quot;X&quot;*

The Cove
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Post by The Cove »

I am going to mention a variety - in no particular order.

Buying condoms for the first time. Buying tampons. Buying... When we acquire something we never had before.

Beating up someone. Facing that bully. Defending a friend. Putting your life on the line. When we face new levels of violence both inner & outer.

Realizing god, death, profound love. When we deepen our sense of selves.

Reading & understanding that book, getting the point of that film, earning that degree, throwing it all out the window to start over. When we make jumps and new paths in knowledge.

One could say ritual is a marker of what is common in all humanity.

Historically this marker has been marked and taken as a tool by those who wished to empower whatever it was they wished to enpower and weaken or subvert other elements.

Because modern ritual does not easily fit into the dictates of it's apparent history - does not confuse the issue - but rather points out the need to confuse it by default.

A good question would be; how come modern culture must make obscure what is universal? What is this ancient proto-ritual of forgetfullness that is imposed upon the masses?

I have a theory - but would like to read what others think before I throw down my next card. It is boring to answer ones own questions sometimes.

littlewing
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Post by littlewing »

I think the attraction of boys to rappers' gangs is a yearning for the rite of growing up passage. Acceptance into the group is hard-won; and for boys, very much a hero's admittance (however misguided). I wonder how much we really have changed... at least in our need for a hero's passage into adulthood. It's just an unanswered need. I agree it's a modern spiritual crisis.

Can't see schooling as a rite of passage. Certainly is a ritual, and long-term. But the rite of passage should be the culmination ritual... the test??... at the end.

Certainly agree the rites are as important as the myths. They bring us together in our humanity. A church my husband joined called Spiritual Humanism honors this need; and collects rituals, old and new, to use in weddings/funerals/other rites of passage. These 'cultural creative' weddings/funerals have carried a powerful vibrant impact unique to that particular event. You know, something beyond a 'theme wedding'... maybe what people are really seeking when they do those.

lw

Lizpete
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Post by Lizpete »

Littlewing I agree with your observation that maybe school becomes one long ritual with the rite of passage being graduation. After high school a student traditionally moves on to a different sort of life. College, I believe is the next step in the tribe's approval and plan. Does the rite need to be something more than a party?

Of course one can drop out. Could one fail a rite of passage in ancient times? Maybe the wilderness (be it a bear or mental illness) just ate you. A tribe might carry you along a bit until they couldn't, and you'd be one of the first to go. Marked some how that way.

When I lived in Japan I was taken to a mountain place where elderly parents were abandoned to die. (Minoo in Osaka.) There was a statue of a man carrying his aged mother up to the mountain wilderness. How terrible. (And a sense of great sadness marking the spot.)

But then again how horrible to let children wander alone into the forest. (See the fairy tale of Babba Yaga, I believe. Or maybe Hansel and Gretel... Wicked Stepmother indeed. What happened to that sleeping father protector?) Sorry maybe this last paragraph off in a little different direction.

---
Cove I'm sorry, your explanation took me as too many rituals... :) No?
All human wisdom is contained in these words: wait and hope. Alexandre Dumas <br>America: The call that every generation must improve itself. *Member Generation &quot;X&quot;*

Lizpete
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Post by Lizpete »

little wing as for young rappers, I'm not sure. Let me puzzle for a moment and indulge me.

I think gangs are sort of a feudal model of manhood- prove it with strength. Of course knights seemed to have a code of ethics or chivalry. (I'm sure some people felt they had them and many people didn't.)

I don't know what rappers have as a model. Maybe minstrels and artistic guilds are on a different path, may be back into education land again here.

(Hmmmm.)
All human wisdom is contained in these words: wait and hope. Alexandre Dumas <br>America: The call that every generation must improve itself. *Member Generation &quot;X&quot;*

noman
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Post by noman »

I am no expert on Japanese culture, Lizpete. I’ve never been to Japan. But reading about it is fascinating. From an American point of view – it has been said that the Japanese aren’t very religious. But I say – that is because our Western emphasis in mythology is on doctrine and belief – not on rites. To the Japanese, we might seem a-religious because we don’t have a certain right way of doing things. And, of course, we draw a hard line between secular and sacred life.

I wonder - if from your exposure to Japanese culture you agree with this assessment – that Japanese religion is ritual based rather than doctrine based. And if you agree, what are the advantages and disadvantages of such a system?

- NoMan

Lizpete
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Post by Lizpete »

Thank you Noman for your question. I have studied Japan a bit, but I'm not sure I'd qualify myself as an expert yet, as I lack some language skills, but I thank you for the challenge of a question.

I guess I'd say I believe that you've started a separate topic with me in this last post of yours. The question you've posed sound intriguing to me and if you'd like to start a new thread topic (not on this one) I will try seriously to answer you. It might take me a little while, but I'd be intent on responding. And just maybe someone else might also come along to help the new discussion along.

Peace-
All human wisdom is contained in these words: wait and hope. Alexandre Dumas <br>America: The call that every generation must improve itself. *Member Generation &quot;X&quot;*

Lizpete
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Post by Lizpete »

Noman, when you are ready, post the new topic and pm me where to find it.

----

In connection to this threads discussion, I started to think about something I read long ago. Of the appearance nearly a century? ago of "Wild Children" who almost magically appeared to walk out of the forests of Europe. (I believe a movie that had Jodie Foster in it might have been an adaption of one of these stories, but I'm not sure.)

These adolescents had somehow managed to survive youth in the forest alone. Yes, think Tarzan, however unlike Tarzan they were "damaged." the account I read noted their troubles. For instance, they had no felt sense of hot or cold. (Wish I could remember more, but it was a while ago that I read it.)

The people who cared for them tried to work with them with the goal I believe of ultimately fitting them into our world, but the children all seemed to have difficulties. All passed away at a premature age. As I read the brief account of the known lives of these children and of the later study and care, I thought that our world with its complications, relationships and love, even in small places, must have been overwhelming to them since they had grown up all alone. (Or mostly alone. Faced down the terrors of the forest before they even knew what a spear was in concept perhaps?)
All human wisdom is contained in these words: wait and hope. Alexandre Dumas <br>America: The call that every generation must improve itself. *Member Generation &quot;X&quot;*

The Cove
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Post by The Cove »

Yes there are too many rituals. But as Clemsy remarked upon in his post the rite has moved from the group experience to the personal one. Also, as you pointed out in the last post - we live in a very complicated world, where the multi-ethnicity and multi-cultural elements are - for the greater part, interwoven on different levels according to the place.
A modern city is the obvious example - but another - equal in relevance - would be a young teenager watching Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon in some backwoods predominantly white town; would be exposed to the rights of passage of a new hero - in a foreign context - and emulate that, albeit sudo-unconsciously - hence bringing moral & philosophical concepts of ancient china into play and evolution and the rites of passage it illustrates.
So, beyond the obvious biologically & socialogical based rites of passage there has come into play a rather modern spin on an ancient phenomenom - the rite of cultural passage. Or rather, a naturally occurring comparitive mythology, based on the intergration of complex cultural variation into a viable tool or model for the modern hero or villian that lives in us all.
Yes, there are too many rituals - it is a mark of the modern world, harking back to the city-states of Babylon.

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Post by Lizpete »

Dear Cove,

I find your posts so intriguing, so fully packed with concepts. Its a little difficult for me to work with, but I'll try. Let me go back a bit to what you wrote before.

Does a condom available on a store shelf mean the acceptance of society for that person to buy it and use it for whatever purpose? To a very minor degree I might think so, but then there is Clemsy's point there must be some more involvement by society. Frankly, I think of the movie "The Gods Must Be Crazy" Where a coke bottle falls from the sky and is put to different than intended uses. (I've done that before I think with an idea or two...)

There has to be some foundation I think, if the object is used for the proper purpose, and not so much learning against it. Where in the tribe does that foundation arise, is something you are suggesting- maybe?

With an educational system learning is structured and sanctioned by a community. ?Supported by parents? The cultural passage is worked on by others and hopefully not so much by kids, but by others (adults) who can see the grains of truth/pearls of wisdom in the kids' experience and their own. Maybe others' experiences too...

I'm not sure I've responded to your statement appropriately, but I'm going to leave it here for now.
All human wisdom is contained in these words: wait and hope. Alexandre Dumas <br>America: The call that every generation must improve itself. *Member Generation &quot;X&quot;*

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Post by AndrewT.O. »

Rituals, to my mind, are necessary because they speak to the subconscious, and (for instance) tell the child "you are now an adult".

Why is this necessary? Because we consciously and subconsciouly classify human beings, including ourselves. We have ideas about what a child/adult is (symbols), and what a child/adult does (rituals). While the gradual putting away of childish things could plausibly serve as a transition message of sorts to the subconscious, this is probably not always powerful enough, simply because in our classifications, there is no in between state: One is a child, or a youth, or an adult etc. There may be many such classes/states, but there is no gradual continuum. There are discreet differences in our minds. Our minds say "this is where a youth stops and and an adult begins", and unless there is a similar demarcation in our actual lives, the subconscious may be tricked into theinking no transition has taken place.

I agree 100% with you about the arbitrariness of these demarcation rituals. That is their one flaw, as Prof Campbell also seems to suggest. To my mind, this is another challenge modern society has to overcome: finding a way to reconcile the varying timeframe of development among humans with the need for transition rituals.

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Post by AndrewT.O. »

Clemsy wrote: I'd say it has. One could say this is a drawback of a multi-cultural society. What rites are to be used? We are connected by the milestones of school graduations, drivers license acquisition, marriage (the only potentially religious one on the list) and retirement. But do these activate the energies necessary to differentiate between this stage of life and the next?
I agree that these (among others) are the new rituals to be used and understood as such. I also agree that they do not as yet pack the same psychological wallop as, say, confirmation used to. However, I believe that this is because we have not yet "sanctified our landscape", to paraphrase Campbell. The reason the hunting rituals were used as a rite of passage for boys in hunting cultures was because hunting was such an integral part of their lives. To my mind we should be looking around us, finding our analogues to hunting, and, through art, infusing these with psychological power/symbolic relevance. We should make our freeways holy the way they made the buffalo trail holy, etc. Only when we have thoroughly soaked our new technological/societal environment with rich, coherent mythos, can we expect to draw any kind of benefit from it. Like worshipping the buffalo in gratitude for the hunt.

Clemsy wrote: Within our various religious traditions there are rites, for sure, but they don't carry the weight they once did and don't bind the larger community. Rather they define differences, no?
Yes they do. Eventually that will add to the richness of our new world culture. In fact it is a necessary element of it. But you are correct. We still need universal rituals. To become "a man in america" you need "american man rituals". However, as I said above, we already have them. It is a matter of doing the artistic work to fuel them.

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Post by The Cove »

Since we are born, the abyss is. We pay for that glory by standing, balanced on the edge. The rites of passage going on and on again - being the chasm, being the mountain, existing in between. The inner mind always knowing the truth - 'I just came from eternity and am soon to return.'

Locked